Read the FAQ !

[VividT E X]

Now I do not know how to bring this up, but I must do it to see if any of the members feel any different from me.

Disclaimer :

I don not claim to be any better that any of the fictive members that I will point to in this thread. I also do not intend at any point in this post to establish any kind of superiority of any x member of the 405th on any other member. If you feel like this post contain anything resembeling to these two attitudes, please note that they are unintentional.

Here I go.

Lately on the 405th I am amazed at the patience of the core active and older members around here when faced to thae late increase of a particular behaviour in our newer members.

Old threads are revived a lot more than before, multiple new ones are made by a single user on the motive of asking a question ( sometimes ones that would be answered with google ) and to join with that last one, disregard the stickies (valuable threads assembled with passion by older users for future refference by these very individuals I am reporting ) to jump right to , in some case, harassing long inactive members for files ( to name one in particular ).

Now I belive strongly in the hard and dedicated work some people like Chernobyl and Fangs to name a few do around here. Helping along lost spartans to thier goals with duty. They sure are invaluable individuals with great knowledge and experience. But I also strongly belive in sparing help and first looking around if anyone before you ever was in your situation. If ever you think about something, the chances that tought is a new one are small. If it occures that after research you are indeed alone with your question and in desperate need of an answer I'm sure anyone around here would be up to help you along... Hell me first !

But sadly I feel like the trend of spending time to seek other's experiences trough looking in thier threads extensively is a thing of the past. I'm under the impression that some of the newer members kind of use the 405th as a customer service more than a place to share experience around.

One of the ways people here were used to exchange with eachothers is to start a thread in thier name and go from there, asking to the comunity anything that may bug them at the time in this thread... Now tell me if you think I'm wrong... ( After all it's my opinion )

I just compared the days of LongshotX, LilTyrant, Roxyroo, Vshore and. Carpathia, and it seems to me things worked differently...

Maybe there is no such sentiment ( how ever messed up it has been expressed ) in the comunity right now, but eventhough I do not personaly deal with these cases like Chernobyl or Commander Palmer do, I still sometimes feel tiered...

Again, it's just a conversation starter so, comment away !

 

[Ashgro]

i'm a newer member so i cant speak of the old days and even though i agree with a lot of you points i'm really not a fan of complain posts they make things more negative then they need to be in my opinion.
As for the newer members bringing posts back and starting new threads for everything most of them won't stick arround and the ones who do will learn the rules.

 

[VividT E X]

I'm really not a fan of complain posts they make things more negative then they need to be in my opinion.

I knew ahead of writing this thread that I would kind of sond like that but if anything, I was mearly looking to see if I was wrong to think that way and the last part of your comment certainly points ou things I simply did'nt think about... So thanks for that

 

[Ashgro]

VividT E X no problem like i said i agreed with most points but its kind of a problem that solves itself i love your helmet btw thats quite the paintjob to

 

[Chernobyl]

A fine point, but as Ashgro said, this is generally a problem that solves itself. Members who expect handouts generally find out pretty quickly that we're not here to just walk people through the process at every step, and those that can't handle doing some research for themselves generally don't stay long. Those that adopt the 'search first, ask later' mentality tend to have a longer tenure here.

 

[TurboCharizard]

Those that adopt the 'search first, ask later' mentality tend to have a longer tenure here.

Then there's some weirdos like me that didn't even jump past the lurker stage into posting until a suit was done and convention ready almost a year after first signing up.

I definitely agree with Vivid that the necro-posting asking a question to an OP that hasn't logged into the 405th for months is getting a bit old but I think it also has to do with the format of this forum. Some of us are used to the oldschool PHP forums whereas some of the younger members just never experienced how they tick.

 

[Chernobyl]

I definitely agree with Vivid that the necro-posting asking a question to an OP that hasn't logged into the 405th for months is getting a bit old but I think it also has to do with the format of this forum. Some of us are used to the oldschool PHP forums whereas some of the younger members just never experienced how they tick.

I think it's less to do with how the 405th works, and more with the fact that the information new members would require right off the bat just isn't as accessible as it should be. I'm as guilty as anybody for sometimes throwing in the towel and saying 'use the stickies, use the search tool', but the simple fact of the matter is that, often, the information people need is buried and difficult to locate. Going forward, we need to champion a renewed effort in picking apart the sticky threads for relevant information, and putting easy-to-use, easy-to-locate guides for newer users to use that will help mitigate necroposting and 'help me!' threads in the future.

 

[Reclaimara]

I can't speak for the old days either as I'm here since a year, but I agree with you from reading all the older threads. They were more about sharing with each other.

I personally want to snarl at some threads or people of the examples like you pointed. Harassing people for files - also often in those few years old threads where people didn't log in, making new threads asking the very same questions.

If I would count each new thread with same question just for a month, I think I could make a nice list.

I remember people making new threads with 'how to make visor' almost every day or few times a week. I always think... is it so damn hard to use the search function?

I see often very same threads created that are still on the first page of the New Recruits page. By newest members of course.
Like you said, it's sad and irritating to see that people don't want to spend their own time searching for something but they expect you to take your time writing them answers (for the xxx time).
To me, they have no respect to your time at all. If they even wanted, they could have found that answer in not even 5 minutes.
(but to be honest, this is how today many people function, mostly younger people - they expect you to do everything for them)

What is even worse - those kind of people tend to just ask a question, then wait for the answer and never come back.

I bet half of the new members never read even a part of the FAQ anyway, judging from questions I read.

I mean, most things and answers can be found in sticky threads. Search option offers even more.
While it isn't perfect, it isn't that hard either.
I am sure if there would be a perfect thread with ALL the information in it, there would be still people who would just skip it and make threads asking those questions anyway.


I always appreciate and I am more eager to help people who actually take time and do some reading, searching for the answer and solution and don't just expect others to deliver them everything on a plate.

 

[FANGS]

Actually this is an issue that affects most forums. I actually did a panel earlier this year and tried to address it. We've become so accustomed to being able to google everything and get an immediate answer that it becomes expected. I've even had the experience in person from time to time so it really is a common issue that extends beyond forums.

Having said that, we really can work together to ease the frustrations of members and report issues when you see them and/or politely mentioning to the person posting what they could do to find their answers etc. We absolutely want the 405th to be open and welcome but I don't expect anyone here new or old to be an Information Booth. I also don't expect anyone here to be rude to people who really are just doing what they do in their every day lives and aren't intending to cause any ruffled feathers. I know it can be frustrating but I'd rather have you walk away and not respond than show your frustration to that person.

We're working towards having a more easily accessible forum and hopefully that will ease this. Honestly though, it's not going to go away no matter how organized we are. I'm always willing to hear suggestions about ways to improve. Just make sure to tag me if it's in a thread so I don't miss it or send me a PM.

 

[peterthethinker]

FANGS perhaps a TUT on how to use the fourms search system better? I know that on google and the othere you can use AND and OR and other tricks to make the back end get the results you desire.

If the problem lies where our internal search is not as smart as google then a few pointers for the new folks might be usefulll to offset the qurks ( Eg no spell check that kinda stuff)

Every little bit helps ..

 

[Reclaimara]

Oh, I'd consider a search function here to be like a google search function but all 405th-centered... meaning some people don't use google either

 

[arma358]

I'm not sure if there's an easy fix, and I understand CommanderPalmer's aggravation. Honestly, the biggest thing I can think of is to update the FAQ with some important costuming questions as well. While I understand the need for forum moderation, (I've been there...as a small community manager) I also don't think calling every single person out for breaking one rule or another in public so frequently as helpful. Report the post, and move on, IMHO.

 

[Reclaimara]

arma358 - of course. No hard feelings or what so ever, but reporting post doesn't always help. It helps when someone is spamming - creating many new threads, so the mod has to delete some threads later on.
But why would you report a post of someone just asking question? Maybe an obvious question that has been asked over 9000 times, but still.

 

[peterthethinker]

the issue is google has the brain power of cortana ..... our search is much more limited on the software side.... If you are use to google then this forums search is like yahoo circa 2000 .



If I search for 3Dprinting vs 3 d printing its not smart enough to group the words togehter .

 

[Sentri]

Here is the thing though, not only do we have the search function here, but I have even had threads from this forum show up in google searches, or I even use google itself to search our forums by adding 405th to whatever it is that I'm searching.

for example:
479 red vs blue will bring up the character from the series, but when I type in 479 red vs blue 405th, the first thing to show up is my build thread here. I guess many don't think about using google to search within our site as well.

 

[Chernobyl]

I'm always willing to hear suggestions about ways to improve. Just make sure to tag me if it's in a thread so I don't miss it or send me a PM.

I... uh... did. Over a year ago, in fact. In fact, this has been something that's been brought up ad nauseum - I, or somebody with the powers and ability to do so - needs to go in and consolidate all of the Sticky threads, especially the ones that are taking up a good third of the Costumes section. This information then needs to be made visible and accessible to all new members when they join the forums. I don't know, maybe somewhere like THIS might serve well?

I don't mean to seem crabby, but the dissemination and availability of information to all members has been a movement I've championed for years now, but I haven't ever had any sort of official staff backing to help me get the work done (and not for a lack of asking either). I'm willing to do the work, I've had plenty of time on my hands to get the work done - but without the correct sanctions I'm unable to do much more than just twiddle my thumbs. Right now we simply aren't doing enough for our members in terms of presenting information. We - members and staff alike - have become complacent with just sticking threads and assuming members will read them. The Sticky Index hasn't been updated in over two years, and even that's easily missed by a casual glance.

Best solution to all of this? Simple - as I stated above, information needs to be visible and accessible to all members of the community from registration onwards. The information is here, ready to be digested. It just needs to be collected, processed, and then published in a format and location that is both easy to locate and consumed. I would recommend some sort of Starter Pack or at the very least a mandatory-to-read thread presented to all members upon registration that directs them to the tools they'll need in order to get started.

 

[Northern Dragon]

I have learnt first hand during this year most of the points you highlighted. I did ask a question on a dead thread but I did so to get an answer from a search I had made on my own. I know the moderators want us to search but that is what happens and a question is just asked where the new members think is best to ask it. As for the Stuck threads, they are not clear from the get go. The moment after signing up they are not shown to the new members at all. They have to be told to go find them, hence the issue you brought up. It has been quite a while since I signed up so I am not fully aware of the new sign up process, but that is where the issues start. The site lacks some transparency and obvious paths to finding them. The solution is quite clearly in the question (or problem in this case) in my opinion.

 

[Reclaimara]

For old and dead threads - why not just close them after some time?
This way no one will write on 2-5yr old threads.

 

[FANGS]

Thank you for all of your input!

 

[PerniciousDuke]

I agree with Chernobyl, FANGS. The solution does seem simple enough, the sanction is hard to come by. We need to fine tune our tutorial and orientation content and make it readily visible upon signup. It's not a matter of creating from scratch. Even the orientation video is 10 years old now, but the message still holds to imprint the values of respect and community involvement to our new members. When more than half the problem is that they just can't find it, you've got a pretty easy problem. From there, some of the tutorials could be consolidated with a few hours work. I hope this matter is something you guys could come to make changes to because I can really see the benefit of it. I, and I'm sure many others, would be willing to put up help in any way possible.

*edit: I did want to point out, that a FAQ might not be the end-all solution. Some of what I'm hearing here is that these are things that people might not ask, but rather do. Like what a double post is, what a necro post is, where to post questions or the downside to posting a new thread with every thought. Though, a FAQ would help to direct people who want to know things like where can I download files, how do I use the search feature (like how you can use the search feature to search the whole site or individual sub-forums), how do I post pictures and tons of other things that are actually hard to find the answers to. Keep in mind to, that many people don't even know what a sticky is, so these things might need to have some kind of banner during signup that direct new members from the get-go.